Tape 005 - Clip 3
Short_Description:
The friday meeting
TranscriptText:
DM Doiou want to be realistic and say1 100 geek hours
MT We have some logistical problems like who are the runners
TH got got well we have us three and..
DM But see they need to be glued to their machine right you cant be runner
TH Well Im lot more pointy headed than used to be so and have like right now
have sort of mini runners on my team like Sarah is off harassing Roskind about
the state of Java right now You know so mean we have that capability The
person
who needs to be really glued to their machines is Chris on my team
DM The person who needs to be glued in one place is the person who will have to sit in
room which is probably you Michael right
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Tape Friday 3/31/ meeting
TH Well think we could take turns laughs
MT Ill just roll my machine into the pit and make that my office
DM Yeah thats what you should do Thats what Hoffman does every day at 500
Curly People who have bugs we can make them wear red shirts laughter
MT Well the other thing we can do is post guards outside the office of people who
have bugs Im sorry youre not allowed to disturb Mr Weinstein at this time
MT AU Right were going to ask the Center Brothers and heard Don and Tara and
Eric
TH Were going to arm you heavily since youre marketing traffic
Roskind enters
MT dont think thats going to be enough
Who else do we need
Well Rays going to call me back on Monday
Is he going to be in on Monday
Michael Laguardia
MT Laguardia yeah
TH Wait doesnt isnt he focusing on the P-Word stuff in the license
DM The P-Word No no hes not hes waiting for the next shoe to drop from
somebody He just talks to the lawyers and says what about that deal
MT This is order of magnitude good place to start So these people are going to be in
the pit at 1100am Monday And are we going to require these people to be in the
pen or are we going to send the road runners out
off Lets send the runners out lets meet at 1100am cause lets see what is it
off You should have all those people there and say..
DM No we better be running and telling these people now because some of them you
know are getting ready to collapse and may be dragging themselves home to lick
their wounds for the weekend and not know
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red This is the opportunity for them to come and say you know need help Im too
buried Im too this Im too that and then we set the expectation that get ready
because we may come to people that arent one this list and say youre in this
week
DM Michael is there any had question today about are we going to have the Bug list
or the bulk up as we start doing getting ready to do the commenc-and if we get
bugs filed against you for..
MT Ne been waiting to see that happen and it
DM No ones been ready to commence yet but is that going to make the number
artificially high or..
MT No thats just the truth
Oh OK good
There havent been any commits yet
JR Well 2.0 commits
MT 2.0 commits no We need to start the 2.0 commits next week All right so that
would be Monday
Ml So thats bug count end of the meeting Monday this list should be really small and
we should at Monday 330 we should be planning an equally aggressing plan for
making sure the commence all happens Right
red Or B-code is broken Monday cause undoubtedly the first time you do it its
going to be pandemonium confusion..
DM We need to make sure we do the commits OK thats one agenda item
MT Anything else about bug counts Beta Program
red Well the only thing we didnt do is kind of stick based approach we were talking
you know should we hand something out..
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MT OK actually have fixed budget for this stuff OK Beta Programming
Curly Were still on track for next Friday
MT We are not giving our source code out next Friday Next Friday is the day that we
are supposed to be done would expect urn probably the middle of the next
week
Curly The middle of the following week And then when are you actually going to choose
which three partners we actually have
MT How about by Friday
Curly By Friday
Mt So far only have one request
Curly You have two because sent you two
NIT Ohdol
Curly Yeah
red Choose or say these are the ones think and why as opposed to Michael
choosing
Curly The ones that sent you are both theyre both very interested in developing the
code The first one it was Canadian developer believe The second one is at
home Theyre nice because theyre weIl...the want to sort of thing with the
code so my question is Ill be interested in Beta Testing it
off What dont want it to do..
off Is go fix their bugs in 4.05..
MT No no no they want to read the code and take the function out and put it in some
other product
off dont know we need to determine that
MT would be really happy to just deputize you to just pick the people to be on the Beta
program
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JR We dont want rich people though we want people that are just
real small
individuals..
TH Thats all basically we want to get it to
red Wait what you can do is just send out short e-mail to Leeds and say here is
what think is required for person being beta and then let other people say..
MT Wed like one customer for each platform
general agreement brainstorming
MT OK Java-ectomy
TH So sent Sarah in search of you did she find you
JR No she caught me on the phone but can tell you updated the bug earlier today
what wve don is were were trying
to get demonstration of progress by getting
UNIX check-in Were hopeful that wed get it today but now it looks like its
slipping but we are working well probably work Saturday Sunday whatever it
takes and so we expect early next week thats what put in the bug they think
that Monday is quite possible theres chance that late tonight it will actually be
ready to go But were going to do UNIX first to show good faith and also
because we think LINUX is like the real most critical and then were hoping that
day or two later to do MAC and Windows
Ml Sounds like youre going to be lucky to be all done by Friday
JR Wre struggling were were but the thing that happened was we had some 4.05
escalations this week which took tsp some time..
TH Brian and Don are both on call if necessary not to say were not
DM you said you were psyched up for 4.05 escalations do you believe that youre
not going to be sidetracked next week because..
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JR think the thing thats going to push us to not be sidetracked is well get
rid of 4.05
and then..
DM Thatli happen..
JR Theres actually still and escalation still going on we have security problem
that...we need to study and understand exactly why and thats going to be either
me and maybe Raman little bit...Not unless youre slipping
mean...did you
already ship
glas No no Im mean want to make candidate builds on Monday if we can get these
fixes
JR Weve already put in several fixes in the past couple days for various bugs uh but
that was escalation effort that just took time away...Well Fmjust trying to
understand exactly whats going on thats all
DM So but youre saying candidate builds on Monday whats your confidence level
there because you were at 20 the day before yesterday..
glas Were bouncing off 10 of them today
JR just trying to save lace and get some reason why this is going on
MI Are there people work for Bob whos name is not on this list who could make
your life easier by showing up
JR No no..
JR We really are moving We really are under control want you to just no freak out
that that..
PAT Im not freaking out..
DM Its done when its done and its not going to be done any sooner than that
JR think were progressing
nice and methodically and that we need to be careful
and. .there was preliminary thing
that Brian did but that was soil of harsh seat
oç.i
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of the pants can force it to link without these things and they have to go looking
around you actually care whether it runs after you link..
MT Whether you can build it in universe where those directories dont exist
JR Right so we have two stub files that were building basically were going lib
image each of these things that decides the call randomly we have to catch the call
and decide whether theyre reasonable to make Theyre ver theyre progressing
very methodically
Tara ...lets talk about that after this lets talk about the because want to talk about it
after this because want to talk to you about the moz medium stuff and make sure
that were all in synch about that
JR But certainly it the clear plan is want to keep Java running for on commercial
build at the same time as want to cut the heck out of it for the free source No que
some people get that confused but that should never be question
Ml Yeah well the great thing about this is the OJI thing theyve got
like big footprints
now right ..so we know exactly what to test out OJI interface against
because...its we got one thing
for every place theres one of those ugly..
JR no actually thais the interesting thing is were not definitely doing it you might
imagine that
MT did imagine that.
JR ..thats right
MT was completely wrong
JR Thats right were stumpin were stumping so that the answer is were leaving in
the calls that have to go to stump if you want to replace the Oil you may have to
come up with slightly
different way
MT hold on second if its too late for Oil but Lhat-fl-Y S...
misc discussion
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TH we have the power plant project crap with Scott we have Java-ectomy we have the
security thing we have the remaining work that need to be done for moz media and
Mac and UNIX .those are the only ones that am currently aware of..
DM Were not going to require for Chris Mac stuff right
TI-I Oh the project stuff yeah Im done the only other concern is what Jaime is doing
for the tree and maybe would clarify what his procedures are and show that
should bring us..
MT ishe done
JR No
MT Is he 10% done
TH uh I...its hard to know exactly what he did he did lot but considering that
were touching almost every file hes probably somewhere in that vicinity
JR Understand as our car pool lands we will have built on all the other platforms
there is high confidence level we will have cross platform living
MI but what is the likely day that youre going to land if not Monday
JR There is very high probability
that Monday prior to Monday night UNIX will
land
DM all right so thems high probability that were not going to have people getting
away We do have another issue that wanted to bring up on the tree and maybe
this is the right time on that to put it on the list Is that we do have things that build
that dont work like right now MAC is on the floor and Pinkerton and chin are all
over it so theyre trying to figure that out and we want to try to get
that in state
because if you land your
stuff and you cant test the damn thing then ..it would be
bad
JR heard this rumor Zawinsky and were arguing saying that commercial
Communicator is busted and is this true in any way or is he just alarmist and
trying to win an argument 7qc9
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DM Its busted in the sense that if you build the commercial tree you get like all the
images and stuff the horked images from the Moz tree and everything else and
some of the things are turned off but its supposed to work
TH .. right now the commercial tree is on the floor and the reason..
MiT but its an emergency that its on the floor
JR right oh no were treating this with utmost OK
TH the problem is that with the actual the commercial tree is actually different from
what has been mercury tip and were trying to get all those apps
fixed so we can
see what the commercial tree is and fix that
DM but were not going to have all that fixed until we have the UNIX and MAC
changes in for MOZ
MiT right but we could be doing commercial tree build every day and that would some
percentage
of the coverage we would need to make sure..
DM and we could do moz light on the other two
MiT right OK. .so urn source code announcement
Curly Well the plan is next week were going on next week were going to go on internet
world and well be announcing some of the things down there about the source
code and whats happening
MT under NDA
Curly under NDA to uh news type of press
JR So is this like the kind of thing you cant say anything about
Curly dont say anything until think June laughs Thats step one ..step two is..
red is that just Nickie presentation
pctftenenttAor is there more to that
Curly yes but its exclusively Nickies presentation
red All right could you...breff1 just
for beneficial reasons..
through glass
shots of meeting
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Sweater Its lot harder to get sto when youre reading press
release..
L/
Ml All right who do call now that got Kellys voice mail
Hey this is Michael Toy can you do me big flavor need someone to page Jeff
Weinstein and get him to call 2024 All right thanks by
Ml All right Mail-ectomy
red He seemed to think that like day and half so that seemed liked there was
possibility
to do something
MT But that will satisfy thyare an awful lot like the government
misc conversation through ej.Lthp
MT We have some logistical problems like who are the runners
TH got got well we have us three and..
DM But see they need to be glued to their machine right you cant be runner
TH Well Im lot more pointy headed than used to be so and have like right now
have sort of mini runners on my team like Sarah is off harassing Roskind about
the state of Java right now You know so mean we have that capability The
person
who needs to be really glued to their machines is Chris on my team
DM The person who needs to be glued in one place is the person who will have to sit in
room which is probably you Michael right
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TH Well think we could take turns laughs
MT Ill just roll my machine into the pit and make that my office
DM Yeah thats what you should do Thats what Hoffman does every day at 500
Curly People who have bugs we can make them wear red shirts laughter
MT Well the other thing we can do is post guards outside the office of people who
have bugs Im sorry youre not allowed to disturb Mr Weinstein at this time
MT AU Right were going to ask the Center Brothers and heard Don and Tara and
Eric
TH Were going to arm you heavily since youre marketing traffic
Roskind enters
MT dont think thats going to be enough
Who else do we need
Well Rays going to call me back on Monday
Is he going to be in on Monday
Michael Laguardia
MT Laguardia yeah
TH Wait doesnt isnt he focusing on the P-Word stuff in the license
DM The P-Word No no hes not hes waiting for the next shoe to drop from
somebody He just talks to the lawyers and says what about that deal
MT This is order of magnitude good place to start So these people are going to be in
the pit at 1100am Monday And are we going to require these people to be in the
pen or are we going to send the road runners out
off Lets send the runners out lets meet at 1100am cause lets see what is it
off You should have all those people there and say..
DM No we better be running and telling these people now because some of them you
know are getting ready to collapse and may be dragging themselves home to lick
their wounds for the weekend and not know
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red This is the opportunity for them to come and say you know need help Im too
buried Im too this Im too that and then we set the expectation that get ready
because we may come to people that arent one this list and say youre in this
week
DM Michael is there any had question today about are we going to have the Bug list
or the bulk up as we start doing getting ready to do the commenc-and if we get
bugs filed against you for..
MT Ne been waiting to see that happen and it
DM No ones been ready to commence yet but is that going to make the number
artificially high or..
MT No thats just the truth
Oh OK good
There havent been any commits yet
JR Well 2.0 commits
MT 2.0 commits no We need to start the 2.0 commits next week All right so that
would be Monday
Ml So thats bug count end of the meeting Monday this list should be really small and
we should at Monday 330 we should be planning an equally aggressing plan for
making sure the commence all happens Right
red Or B-code is broken Monday cause undoubtedly the first time you do it its
going to be pandemonium confusion..
DM We need to make sure we do the commits OK thats one agenda item
MT Anything else about bug counts Beta Program
red Well the only thing we didnt do is kind of stick based approach we were talking
you know should we hand something out..
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Tape Friday 3/31/ meeting
MT OK actually have fixed budget for this stuff OK Beta Programming
Curly Were still on track for next Friday
MT We are not giving our source code out next Friday Next Friday is the day that we
are supposed to be done would expect urn probably the middle of the next
week
Curly The middle of the following week And then when are you actually going to choose
which three partners we actually have
MT How about by Friday
Curly By Friday
Mt So far only have one request
Curly You have two because sent you two
NIT Ohdol
Curly Yeah
red Choose or say these are the ones think and why as opposed to Michael
choosing
Curly The ones that sent you are both theyre both very interested in developing the
code The first one it was Canadian developer believe The second one is at
home Theyre nice because theyre weIl...the want to sort of thing with the
code so my question is Ill be interested in Beta Testing it
off What dont want it to do..
off Is go fix their bugs in 4.05..
MT No no no they want to read the code and take the function out and put it in some
other product
off dont know we need to determine that
MT would be really happy to just deputize you to just pick the people to be on the Beta
program
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Tape Friday 3/31/ meeting
JR We dont want rich people though we want people that are just
real small
individuals..
TH Thats all basically we want to get it to
red Wait what you can do is just send out short e-mail to Leeds and say here is
what think is required for person being beta and then let other people say..
MT Wed like one customer for each platform
general agreement brainstorming
MT OK Java-ectomy
TH So sent Sarah in search of you did she find you
JR No she caught me on the phone but can tell you updated the bug earlier today
what wve don is were were trying
to get demonstration of progress by getting
UNIX check-in Were hopeful that wed get it today but now it looks like its
slipping but we are working well probably work Saturday Sunday whatever it
takes and so we expect early next week thats what put in the bug they think
that Monday is quite possible theres chance that late tonight it will actually be
ready to go But were going to do UNIX first to show good faith and also
because we think LINUX is like the real most critical and then were hoping that
day or two later to do MAC and Windows
Ml Sounds like youre going to be lucky to be all done by Friday
JR Wre struggling were were but the thing that happened was we had some 4.05
escalations this week which took tsp some time..
TH Brian and Don are both on call if necessary not to say were not
DM you said you were psyched up for 4.05 escalations do you believe that youre
not going to be sidetracked next week because..
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JR think the thing thats going to push us to not be sidetracked is well get
rid of 4.05
and then..
DM Thatli happen..
JR Theres actually still and escalation still going on we have security problem
that...we need to study and understand exactly why and thats going to be either
me and maybe Raman little bit...Not unless youre slipping
mean...did you
already ship
glas No no Im mean want to make candidate builds on Monday if we can get these
fixes
JR Weve already put in several fixes in the past couple days for various bugs uh but
that was escalation effort that just took time away...Well Fmjust trying to
understand exactly whats going on thats all
DM So but youre saying candidate builds on Monday whats your confidence level
there because you were at 20 the day before yesterday..
glas Were bouncing off 10 of them today
JR just trying to save lace and get some reason why this is going on
MI Are there people work for Bob whos name is not on this list who could make
your life easier by showing up
JR No no..
JR We really are moving We really are under control want you to just no freak out
that that..
PAT Im not freaking out..
DM Its done when its done and its not going to be done any sooner than that
JR think were progressing
nice and methodically and that we need to be careful
and. .there was preliminary thing
that Brian did but that was soil of harsh seat
oç.i
Page 12
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Tape Friday 3/31/ meeting
of the pants can force it to link without these things and they have to go looking
around you actually care whether it runs after you link..
MT Whether you can build it in universe where those directories dont exist
JR Right so we have two stub files that were building basically were going lib
image each of these things that decides the call randomly we have to catch the call
and decide whether theyre reasonable to make Theyre ver theyre progressing
very methodically
Tara ...lets talk about that after this lets talk about the because want to talk about it
after this because want to talk to you about the moz medium stuff and make sure
that were all in synch about that
JR But certainly it the clear plan is want to keep Java running for on commercial
build at the same time as want to cut the heck out of it for the free source No que
some people get that confused but that should never be question
Ml Yeah well the great thing about this is the OJI thing theyve got
like big footprints
now right ..so we know exactly what to test out OJI interface against
because...its we got one thing
for every place theres one of those ugly..
JR no actually thais the interesting thing is were not definitely doing it you might
imagine that
MT did imagine that.
JR ..thats right
MT was completely wrong
JR Thats right were stumpin were stumping so that the answer is were leaving in
the calls that have to go to stump if you want to replace the Oil you may have to
come up with slightly
different way
MT hold on second if its too late for Oil but Lhat-fl-Y S...
misc discussion
Page 13
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TH we have the power plant project crap with Scott we have Java-ectomy we have the
security thing we have the remaining work that need to be done for moz media and
Mac and UNIX .those are the only ones that am currently aware of..
DM Were not going to require for Chris Mac stuff right
TI-I Oh the project stuff yeah Im done the only other concern is what Jaime is doing
for the tree and maybe would clarify what his procedures are and show that
should bring us..
MT ishe done
JR No
MT Is he 10% done
TH uh I...its hard to know exactly what he did he did lot but considering that
were touching almost every file hes probably somewhere in that vicinity
JR Understand as our car pool lands we will have built on all the other platforms
there is high confidence level we will have cross platform living
MI but what is the likely day that youre going to land if not Monday
JR There is very high probability
that Monday prior to Monday night UNIX will
land
DM all right so thems high probability that were not going to have people getting
away We do have another issue that wanted to bring up on the tree and maybe
this is the right time on that to put it on the list Is that we do have things that build
that dont work like right now MAC is on the floor and Pinkerton and chin are all
over it so theyre trying to figure that out and we want to try to get
that in state
because if you land your
stuff and you cant test the damn thing then ..it would be
bad
JR heard this rumor Zawinsky and were arguing saying that commercial
Communicator is busted and is this true in any way or is he just alarmist and
trying to win an argument 7qc9
Page 14
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Tape Friday 3/31/ meeting
DM Its busted in the sense that if you build the commercial tree you get like all the
images and stuff the horked images from the Moz tree and everything else and
some of the things are turned off but its supposed to work
TH .. right now the commercial tree is on the floor and the reason..
MiT but its an emergency that its on the floor
JR right oh no were treating this with utmost OK
TH the problem is that with the actual the commercial tree is actually different from
what has been mercury tip and were trying to get all those apps
fixed so we can
see what the commercial tree is and fix that
DM but were not going to have all that fixed until we have the UNIX and MAC
changes in for MOZ
MiT right but we could be doing commercial tree build every day and that would some
percentage
of the coverage we would need to make sure..
DM and we could do moz light on the other two
MiT right OK. .so urn source code announcement
Curly Well the plan is next week were going on next week were going to go on internet
world and well be announcing some of the things down there about the source
code and whats happening
MT under NDA
Curly under NDA to uh news type of press
JR So is this like the kind of thing you cant say anything about
Curly dont say anything until think June laughs Thats step one ..step two is..
red is that just Nickie presentation
pctftenenttAor is there more to that
Curly yes but its exclusively Nickies presentation
red All right could you...breff1 just
for beneficial reasons..
through glass
shots of meeting
Page 15
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Tape Friday 3/31/ meeting
Sweater Its lot harder to get sto when youre reading press
release..
L/
Ml All right who do call now that got Kellys voice mail
Hey this is Michael Toy can you do me big flavor need someone to page Jeff
Weinstein and get him to call 2024 All right thanks by
Ml All right Mail-ectomy
red He seemed to think that like day and half so that seemed liked there was
possibility
to do something
MT But that will satisfy thyare an awful lot like the government
misc conversation through ej.Lthp
