Tape 002 - Clip 1

Netscape Documentary
Tape 2: More Meeting, DM in Hall TH in build pit
MT: OK anything else?
TH: Yes, OK so, as you can tell, if you haven't noticed, we're moving quite quickly in
build land, things are changing hourly, we have had a couple of occurrences where

Mr. Yei, in his wisdom, sent out a careful explanation of "Do this and don't do this
or you are doomed to die." But people because it's coming from the build team tend
to gloss over it because we get into the habit of doing that. Don't do that. Urn, we
are making massive modifications to the build system all over the place all
platforms, everywhere, you need to be paying attention to these build notifications
go our from anybody on the build team who's working on this. We'll trey and be
good and put like Tree in brackets or something if you want to filter it but you have
got to read this stuff
;:\ £: The Bonsai tree will always be updated, can you always go there and trust that?
TH: We will do our due diligence, but, you know, we put. ..right here's the thing, we
put it on Bonsai, I don't want Chris to spend 20% of his time, for every major
thing just mailing out the notifications right, if we put it on Bonsai, people aren't
really looking at Bonsai, and they miss it. If we send it to client eng people will say
~
well if you don't put it on Bonsai we're going to miss it. We'll try our best to let
you know, but you will ...have to be watching
?: There need to be a definitive way, how will I know whether I can check in right
now?
LT: Is the tree closed? I mean ...if the tree is closed, don't check in
JR: I think it has to be Bonsai is the place you look.
MT: OK, I just want to reinforce something, Urn, the build people, if this were a normal
release the tree would be closed for a long time right now because there are many
major car pools coming in of work that, sanitization work that's been off on a
branch, or off on a private place that's coming in, because if we close the tree and
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Tape 2: More Meeting, DM in Hall TH in build pit
0
" ,t D. '. 11 07..'. 1.-. v
took many car pools for a week, it would be really unlikely that people could check
stuff in to the tree in that week, and we would definitely not make 331. We are
trying to figure out a way to have these car pools land, and have the tree open for
sanitization work to happen at the same time. The thing that's going to make that
work is for us to be really responsive to the build team when they change the rules
on a microsecond because of what this car pool is doing, we've just got to go with
it. We've got to be really sensitive to just rolling with what the build team says.
Because the alternative is saying, well you know it's really just going to take us two
months to get there, cause, you know, we have to go very slowly.
TH: And contrary to popular opinion, we aren't doing it just to piss you off, we're only
slightly doing it just to piss you off (laughter)
?: Just so ...
MT: That's just a benefit, a side effect
TH: Right, we have to get something out of this.
?: Just so everybody knows, especially on the Mac and UNIX platforms, there's
going to be quite a few changes that come in in the next few days, to deal with the
changes Steve has done with the Moz Medium, right, because Moz Medium doesn't
really work on Mac andtust deal with it just be very very careful before you pull,
__--~--,_> right, to know whether the universe has changed. Very very important.
~~/
?: I'd like to make an amendment to that, um, if you're a MAC FE engineer, don't
touch the projects without talking to me first.
?: l IFEET and everything we'd like to say a big thank you to everybody - is Gordon
•
Seraton in here, OK Gordon, you are a maniac! (applause) Gordon I think pulled
36 hour day here the other day, uh, getting all the uh Java stuff and everything else,
and cleaning up some other things that he didn't even have to do, and he still, still
was able to stay awake during Linus Torvald's speech ...!was impressed by th'l
.Otd·1,..•.."1
-1,0"1-
0'" .
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Tape 2: More Meeting, DM in Hall TH in build pit
GS: It was close though
Mf: Way too many people in this room? Are we getting out of here?
?: One more thing, I sent out mail to a bunch of people, this is the XB Nab source
clean up issues ...the back end that aren't cleaned up yet, or at least aren't officially
cleaned up. And I've been trying to get a better understanding of where we are, I
sent out mail to a bunch of you are you the right person to be owning this directory
and what's the current state of it, Ihaven't back from most of you, please reply.
This is really important.
Mf: There's no please about it - reply or die.
?: OK, what he said
LT: One last thing, we're not doing tabs, we're not converting tabs to spaces, we just
rolled over and we said this is stupid, or not stupid, it's just too hard to do, we're
JZ:
just not going there.
But we are going to continue to refer to Lloyd as Lloyd space space space space
space (laughter)
Mf: OK thanks you good bye. I'm calling you back, Jamie, from my office
JZ: OK.
Hallway conversation post meeting
TH: I think we actually need to go into huddles and think about all the things that we're
missing that need to be ...
DM: You thought you were going home early tonight?
TH: I have to, I got no sleep last night, I'll be working from home, I need to like, not be
here for a little while
DM: OK, we need to get this scoped out, and ..!need to figure out how much work this
is in the Mac platform.
0[;-> 67 ; o<1.;z-3
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Tape 2: More Meeting, DM in Hall TH in build pit
TH: I started to try in the ...you read the bug thing I started last night?
DM: I went through a page of it and was like uuuuh, uuuh!
TH: I know, I know, all right I start things that I know we're going to have to go over,
that haven't been, and the things that are sort of in this in between state. But I know
I'm missing stuff too, and I'm trying to go back into the bug list for third party
stuff and then I'm ...the problem is with the third party stuff nobody's gone ba~k in.,o
~ t-v.+- Jbfl ~ePP-1~"t:r:! i11
and put a directory associated with those components. so half the."'so we need to ~-~.
go back and fix that, and that's, I mean I can certainly work on that tonight. J.~
(NWYO~.z...
DM: All right, I'll take a look at all the bugs later on today, and I'll page ypu ...
TH: ...and then we can figure out who to drag in to this.
DM: OK, probably Scott, I'll call Scott.
break
Elevator
?: And now it's faster I think ...did you read that, like one of the performances took
like a billion seconds to load? I'm going, what is ..,! think there was a mistake.
~
TH: What is a billion seconds?
"?: It was a long time ...
?: Do you have any other changes for the build environment...
OK so you want to go the route of three big Tar Balls or do you want to go through
one core Tar Ball, and a dot.sic ball for Mac, a dot zip ball for Windows and
?:
another Tar Ball for unix replicate the code across that.
Does Jamie want to go for that as well?
LT: I will verify with him, but that's probably the most useful thing. People don't want
"--./ to download ...
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Tape 2: More Meeting, DM in Hall TH in build pit
LT: It shouldn't be any more work, we could do it either way, I don't really care, but
it's ...
?: I don't care, Ijust want the engineers happy, and I want Mozilla.org happy, and I
want to make sure until we have the CVS repository, right, that we have an
automated way to create these things, that doesn't make people crazy.
LT: Right, by next week we'll have a decision.
TH: Laughs
?: Well, unfortunately I own the damn bug
LT: Oh, you do, assign it to me, yeah, cause I'll just talk to Jamie about i!.
?: OK, I'll write what we talked about now in the bug, and I'll assign it to you later
today. And give you the input from the Mac weasels and the windows weasels.
I've got to talk to Chris Macabee, but I suspect that he's going to say the same
thing. Right. But it's gonna have to be, we should probably do a dot sic ball for
Mac and a dot zip ball for windows, and tar for. ..
LT: right zip and tar
?: keep the platform people happy, right?
?: Urn, there was some other stupid thing I had to ask you about but I can't remember
what I.t..ISfIght now ... ~
LT: Oh, how do MAC people sign forces ...
LT: You can do this from a UNIX box too, you can just pull this and check it in from a
UNIX box if you had to, right?
?: Hey Pink?
?: Yes sir
?: Oh is that Paul?
?: I have no idea.
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Tape 2: More Meeting, DM in Hall TH in build pit
?: Uh, OK. Oh, maybe Chris knows this, come around to this side
LT: When you do a commit in Mac CVS can you give it options, like dash-R or two
dot O.
(laughter)
Chris: No, you cannot give it options. Yeah, that's exactly what you have to do.
LT: It's just easy you, you just go to your home directory you do a CVSCO, what
you're going to do, and then just do a commit dash R two dot O. We can tell
everybody how to do that, right?
?: Yeah, we can automated it too, right.
LT: Uh ...you don't want to automated it, this is through Sun ...you want it something,
a bug that's on your signature, you're putting your name on this. (Laughter)
?: Automate ....Mac users. No, that was sarcasm.
?: We're not going to be able to automate that. OK, we've got to write this down too.
V You write that down.
LT: I'll write that down, I'll write down how you do this.
?: That sounds like a feature addition for Mac CVS at some point.
?: Oh, wait, you knew about Mac CVS. org, didn't you? ... ?:
?: Did you know what I did, I've got like this commando plan to get Mac CVS out
there. So we created Mac CVS.org, and we're going to GPL it and ...
LT: Really?
?: Yeah
LT: Dynamite! This is with, uh, what's uh, what's his name, the guy who wrote it...he
really wanted this at first..
?: Scott Silver?
LT: No, no Scott, the other guy ....Dan Clifford, yeah!
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?: In fact I'm gonna call Danno this afternoon, and connect.
LT: He'll do the happy dance.
?: So the people at Metroworks are really, they're salivating over it, and the guy, who
was the guy that Paul called? He said yesterday
LT: Kingdon. Call, and get a hold of Jim Kingdon.
?: Back east at some university or something like that
?: Oh right, right, yeah ...
?: So they're all excited about that, we've got a web page ...
LT: Oh cool...
?: And so it's looking pretty cool. We've got, (laughs) we've got our own
sanitization problem too, which is like we've got the whole thing right in ...creating
our own web page and all this shit, it's like ...after I spend like 12 hours on
,:zsl
all ...source 331, then I'm gonna spend 6 hours on this shit...and this dumb ass is
in it too, right, cause he's our build czar for it...oh, it's a real thrill. Anyway, I
wanted to make sure, uh, Jamie new about it because he's on the review board for
that. Once we put that stuff out,
?:
?:
fi
? ?:
?:
Yes, what do you need ...
What's the deal on Mac,"are we still/. .running?
e're running ...
Well, you need to work with Scott, because one of the things that's Scott's doing
right now is he's slamming the wall ...!
?: We are bummed! OK, Pink, call Scott and figure out how we're going to solve this
problem, because it's going to be down to our team to do that, because Gordon's
not worrying about this either, and we've got to figure out a plan on this by the end
of the day tomorrow, because we don't want to be screwing around in the middle
of next week with this shit